945. - Rostam

All right, uh, this episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by Stateside with Kai and Carter, a new podcast from The Guardian. And they are using this podcast to slow down the news and wrestle with the questions that we all have about what's happening in the world. And they do it 3 times a week. Jason, does that sound familiar to you?

We don't really talk about, you know, a lot of international global news items and climates and cultures and sports and things like that. We do talk about fashion and wellness, but for everything else, Kai and Carter are a great place.

All right, so who couldn't use more news? Listen wherever you get your podcasts or watch on YouTube. Halongon. Happy Sunday to you, Jason, the Lord's Day. It is overcast in Los Angeles, but I'll take it. How are you feeling?

Yeah, you take it, you little bitch.

Take it.

It is. Yeah, it's been gloomy. It's been overcast. But you'll notice around noon time, things will really start picking up in terms of sun.

I'm familiar with the system here. I just don't. I reject the system.

Well, that's not the— I'm just letting you know, that's not the daily, everyday system. That's just what's happening right now.

Okay. Got it. Thank you for getting into your—

Sometimes sun happen in the morning.

I guess post—

And you don't have to wait.

Post-Arizona, when I would crack the blinds at 6:30 AM and it was 85. Seeing iguana dying, you know, in front of me.

I guess we all don't get to live in Arizona, okay? Some of us have to be here.

It was only a couple days, but I sort of got the— damn, I, I get it. I get the appeal of this, at least weather-wise. But I'm sure it's unbearable as the summer, uh, trudges on.

Well, that's why God invented a little place called Palm Springs where you can enjoy all of that stuff that you said without having to live— no shade, Some parts of Arizona.

I think I don't know. The food in Arizona might be better. That's, that's real talk. That's real talk. Think about it.

Better than what?

Better than Palm Springs.

Oh, Palm Springs. Yeah. I mean, it depends on the city. Palm Springs has some of the worst restaurants in California. It's psycho how it happens. And I think that one day it's going to take a straight man to come in there and show them how it's done.

That's right. That's right. I just, sorry, I'm looking at a picture I sent to the group chat of It's a Michael Jackson Thriller album cover, but they've put him in denim tiers, puffer, which is something nice, just something nice for the squad.

This is very similar to when I used AI artwork generation tools to create the, I think it was the Don Draper doing the meditation at the last episode of Mad Men, but he was wearing some nice denim tier denim jeans.

Yeah, yeah, I do remember that.

Remember who did it first? First is them jeans and then Michael Jackson.

Well, this, this person on Twitter is saying, just seen the Mexican homie post this like MJ really wore denim teals, tears for real, laughing emoji, crying emoji. So that makes it, you know, it does. Also, the best part about this is it seems that Michael Jackson wearing a fake denim tears puffer has a pocket square in the puffer. Oh, seems like a, like a little, a little, a little pocket with a, a, uh, cheetah print, you know, like an animal print pocket square on the puffer.

Somebody said, hey Claude, make a hot pink puffer jacket with flowers all over it. Somehow gayer. Yes. Animal print. Uh, give me a cheetah kerchief silk in the front pocket, of course.

I was so surprised by that. I was so surprised by that.

Honestly, we were talking about this yesterday with our man Joe from Amplify, and he was saying like, guys, you know a place where you can get a good kind of crew neck sweatshirt, but it has the hoodie pocket in the front?

Only place you can get that on is AI. That's the only place you can get it. Thank God.

Well, we sort of did throw him on the hibachi grill and cook him nice, well done on both sides after proclaiming that. He took it in stride. But this reminds me of something like that where somebody was like, what if there was a puffer jacket that had a front pocket as if it was my blazer where I could put things? Like, is that a, is that an innovation that I'm actually paying attention to?

Oh, no, no, I'm sure that— no, I'm sure there's some, some bad— there's, there's probably been several bad Italian brands over the years that have done this. I don't, I don't think this is AI innovation. I think this is something that is—

I mean, all that is to say, I guess my question to you is you're looking at this pink puffer jacket with the denim tears print over it and it has a little front pocket in there. In terms of like weird hybrid mutant fashion designs, like a hoodless hoodie, this is not that bad, right? Like having just a single slit pocket, there's not any weird stitching to draw attention to it. If you didn't have a square in there, you might not even notice it. I'm kind of not mad at it. But then again, I was asking you about suspenders last episode. So, you know, take that with a grain of maldon.

It's not the most offensive, but it's also, completely useless. So it's sort of like, it's innovate— I wouldn't— innovation is giving it too much credit, I think, is what I would say. Ultimately, I think I would say innovation is giving you too much credit, right? Um, I was unable to afford, um, paying for the, the Joe Budden, uh, member tier on Patreon to hear them talk about Drake. Um, so I don't— I, I'm— for the better, unfortunately. I, I just— there's something about— I don't subscribe to any podcasts on the Patreon platform And it feels, it feels like if I had 3 to 5 more hours of Joe Budden per week, I might actually, that might actually cause me mental damage.

Right. Things are already not going well for you. Right. Not great. And you're just consuming the free tier. If, yeah, if you jumped up to the Discord and you did 5 hours a week of it, it would be, it would be bad for me. I would be doing a welfare check on you.

But from what I can tell from online, it does seem like some quote unquote glazing is going on. Um, read these 3 Drake albums. So I, you know, I, I will, um, I, I think the— I think glazing has gone too far. Not, not as an act, as a term. Like, if you like something—

not as an act, like when you like go all the way down and like you fit it all in your mouth. You don't mean it like that?

No, I do. I, I mean it more— the only— I wasn't going that far. I was talking more— I was thinking more Krispy Kreme, but you do your thing, bro.

But I'm saying, oh, that feel when the glazing goes too far.

I'm saying that, that I think now that any time someone says they like something, it's like, oh, you glazing, bro. Calm— it's like, dude, I don't know if it's— I don't know. I think there's a line there that we have to be a little more, uh, aware of. Because I think this Drake stuff is way too much music, and there's plenty that's good and plenty that's bad. Is that glazing saying it's— it's— some of it's good? Maybe from Joe Budden it is because he's such a hater. And I don't know. I, I just don't know where the line is anymore. I don't know where the line is.

I like that you said it's too much music. Was that a— is that a Drake Canadian bar reference to Much Music, the iconic Canadian music and pop culture channel?

You already know, much like Drizzy, I'm fucking— I'm always working with the triple on top. Come on, bro. You already know.

Haters say I release too much music, but I just release my shit on Mush Music. The music flows through me mutually with the music.

Okay, shit, Jason. All right, shit. Give him a beat. Rawson can give you a beat. I know he's got some shit in Fruity Loops open right now over in Dimes Square. I know he's got some shit ready for you. Yeah, but I mean, I tried to, because I was at the, I was in Arizona at the running retreat with Satisfye when this came out. And unfortunately, that crowd was not rushing back to their rooms to listen to Iceman at 9 PM. You know what I mean?

Everyone stopped giving themselves a stick and poke tattoo of the hardcore band Speed's logo on their upper thigh.

They were able to, they were able to, they were able to sprint in their recovery slides to see Drain play, but they couldn't go listen to Drake. But no, Satisfye wasn't.

What's track 47 say again? I forgot what that one is about.

Are you familiar with Caribbean club music? Oh, you're not? Okay, well, we have some time, but the, um, so I had to listen to it, you know, we did this psychedelic race around like a fucking pump track, like a skateboarding pump track that was extreme, felt extremely dangerous, but I didn't, basically during the prime window, I was unable to listen to Iceman. You know what I mean? So I felt like I was— so I was running, I was on the shit, and I would look at my phone and see all this stuff and see these memes. And I was like, I'm missing out on this for— and I just— I still really haven't had time to process it the way I would like to. I'm keeping it a buck.

You had Habibi FOMO. It's been going around. And I think that you had a hard decision to make. Do I choose outdoor running club or do I choose my one true love, the music of Aubrey Graham?

And I chose fitness.

I got to say, the Polymarket predictions were skewing the other way.

I chose fitness and I don't regret it. You know what I mean? I don't regret it. I don't want to see the pictures of me on lap 40, you know, sucking wind.

But, you know, I was looking at some videos of y'all running around that BMX track and I saw a couple of people and I was like, is that Chris? No, no, no. He wouldn't be acting that like happy to be there.

No, no. They were like, it was a— yeah, that was—

I'm sure you didn't do any little jumps.

I didn't do any flare jumps. I did slight jumps to make it over some of the humps, but I wasn't adding any sauce to it.

Of course.

Because also that Arizona, you know, the, the heat, the fucking, the, the altitude. I was sucking wind. You know, you do 4 laps, you're like, oh, this is fun. And then, you know, at minute 22 of One Step Closer set, you're sort of like, all right, uh, could somebody hand me some electrolytes or something? I need some, I need some nutrition as they call it in the running biz. But I haven't had time to— but Alex is in LA, so she's going to force me to listen to Iceman in the Range Rover. You already know that's every white girl's fantasy. So I don't have much of a choice in this case.

I see in the ice— is that an ice gray Range that you were pushing yesterday in Burbank?

It is. I said, I said, do you guys have the Iceman rental at Enterprise? And they said, oh, Mr. Black, right this way. Please, please come to our— they said, you're actually— you are a subscription tier when it comes to— you're the paid tier. When it comes to Iceman rentals. So I'll get a chance. I know you, you've probably not digested either because you don't really care that much. So I would assume there's some—

there is some stuff I was, I was trying to listen to it in my natural environment, which was in my garage, kind of doing some kettlebells. And I had some moments where I was feeling it and I still haven't really gone in all the way. You know, I think some of the Caribbean-flavored club tracks, some of that calypso rhythm, Alize in My Cup, kind of batty boy bops. There's moments where I'm like, this is going to have some legs. We're going to get the right remixes for it. I think, okay, all in all, it's positive. But we do have our guest here right now and we can— we don't have to stop talking about all this cool stuff. No, because this person just put out a new record. We're going to talk only about other people's music for the next hour.

Well, look, Rostam works on a lot of other people's music. I'm going to try to get to the bottom. Is he buried in the Drake credits somewhere?

We don't know.

You know what I mean? We don't know, because I think Drake could hit a Persian swing maybe somewhere in the next 6 months. He loves to explore cultures, and I'm sure he's had sex with several Persian women. So maybe Rossum could introduce him to that freaky little sitar.

Okay, Persian swing, that's not a setting for like, you know, do a little kind of shuffle quantization on the Ableton. That's not Persian swing number 12. That's not a preset for what I want my drums to sit in the pocket a little bit more.

Okay, no, no, no, I don't think so. All right, but yeah, Rossum's new album American Stories in stores everywhere. I obviously love it. I'm I'm a Rostam head on the record.

Well, not yet. Not yet. We have to go pay some bills first.

But all right, let's give him a call. Rostam's in New York. He was at Rough Trade yesterday, really feeding the streets. But Rostam, put some headphones on for God's sake. Come on, you know the drill. Every time I go to the doctor, I walk out of that bitch feeling dumb. I got no real info. This guy in a white coat just say, you're fine, you know, drink more water.

He knows how to charge my copay.

Exactly.

That's about it.

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This episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by our best friends at BetterHelp. Jason, we're, we're deep into May, which is, uh, Mental Health Awareness Month, and this is just a reminder that whatever you're going through, you don't have to go through it alone. Life is a damn journey. Some days feel good and others feel overwhelming. Whatever's keeping you up at night, it's easy to feel like you have to figure it all out on your own. But the truth is no one has all the answers. Well, and no journey should be alone. Having someone with you to listen, to understand, and to support you can really make all the difference.

I agree, Chris. And sometimes, you know, it, it's nice to be talking to somebody even if they're not even listening, even if you don't even get to be in the same room with them, because what you're doing is you're admitting these things to yourself. And that's the most, that's the most rewarding thing you can do sometimes. So you can have a great little therapy sesh with your perfect therapist at BetterHelp, choosing between over 30,000 people so you can get the right one just for you. Over 6 million people globally are using it and, you know, have some breakthroughs. Go on that walk after your BetterHelp sesh, you know, whatever it might be. Get a nice little lunch all for yourself, maybe a non-alcoholic kombucha, and just think and be like, damn, I really am him. You don't have to be on this journey alone. Find support and have somebody with you in therapy. Sign up and get 10% off at betterhelp.com/howlong. That is betterhelp.com/howlong.

All right, we clapped. All right, Roston, what's really good, baby?

All right, we make it clap, we make it clap.

You're in New York, right? You're in the— you're in your second home.

Uh-oh, we're going to have to talk about my bicoastal elite lifestyle.

This bitch. Damn. Here we go. Oh, no. What if we talk about multiple residences?

Do you want to talk about my built-ins?

I'm happy to give you guys the tour. Wait, I, I actually thought about something. This, this podcast is billed as a bicoastal elite podcast. Last time I checked, which was 6 years ago, I would say tongue—

I would say tongue-in-cheekly.

Yeah. To let you know, the podcast is bicoastal. In terms of Chris lives on one coast, I live on the other. The podcast itself is elite. The product that we produce is elite. We don't consider ourselves to be elitist.

Oh, sure. I didn't say you guys were elitist. That's a whole nother thing.

Oh, sure.

Okay. I didn't say you said that, but I'm saying what we said is what that could be sounding like to be said.

What do you— but what are you trying to say, Rawson? What are you trying to say?

Well, I actually, because I thought when— okay.

I think I know what he's trying to say.

When I did this podcast for the first time, which was October 2020, I believe.

Oh, wow. It was a long time ago. Yeah.

Great memory.

Yeah, it's— I can't believe it's been this long.

I can't either.

Pause.

Especially because I didn't know you guys, and now I'm like friends with you all and your wives and shit, and I love them, and I feel like they're all good. Everyone's good people.

Yeah. We went from me saying, hey, can I call you Rost Man? And you saying, yo, can we dead that? Now you like our wives more than you like us.

No, I didn't. I like everyone equally. But I haven't done Pilates with you, and I have done Pilates with your wife, Jason. And I got to say, the way that she can do a plank is inspiring to me. Like, I can't— like, she just is— it's amazing. Like, 45-second side plank, no problem for Carolyn, period. Period.

I don't mean to— I'm not— and I'm not shitting on Carolyn, but you can't do a 45-second side plank?

I think—

I don't know, for whatever reason, on my shoulder—

I hate it.

I hate it. To be fair, I, I don't like it.

Also, you know, because this is gonna— I'm gonna get roasted for this, but because of like the music stuff, I do have to worry about my wrists sometimes. I don't want to put too much strain on the wrist.

As a cellist, my wrist health—

Chris, I don't think you know how to play a mandolin and kind of what it requires.

Oboe space, we really have to prioritize wrist health.

But I've talked to, I've talked to, I've talked to several musicians though who are like, I'm fucked up because I was wearing a guitar on my left shoulder since I was 12, you know what I mean? And now my shit is just kind of—

Doctor said I need a bachiotomy because the fucking Jazzmaster fucked me up.

Do you have, do you have issues No, but I can also do 8 pull-ups with a 45-pound weight vest.

I've been like, okay, well, that was just— you were leading me to what I wanted to say.

I mean, heating up that side of my life.

But wait, he's heating up.

I do want to say, apparently Joni Mitchell, she plays this Parker Fly guitar, which is like a crazy looking guitar. And like, it doesn't— you like, you'd be like, wait, why is Joni Mitchell playing this guitar? It's like literally like David Bowie's guitar player from like the latter era Bowie. Is playing this guitar.

Parker Fly?

It's the craziest looking guitar.

Like, it doesn't— it's not Joni— it's not Joni Mitchell aesthetically.

No, it's just crazy shape. Like, it just feels like Fifth Element aesthetic, which I love.

But maybe the guitar player of Living Colour would play it. Sure.

I'm not going to put this on Joni, but why?

Because it's incredibly light. It's made of, like, carbon fiber. It's totally hollow.

It's like your new iPhone, Chris. Thin.

I did get the iPhone Air. It's changed my life.

I, I, I have a photo of that discussion. I have a friend who he's this, he has this freakish nature where he buys every Apple product and returns it within the time just because he wants to experience every Apple product. What? Yes. Freak. He's a, he's a total freak.

That's cool.

He went from novelist to corporate lawyer, but he did get tripped up by the iPhone and the iPhone Air because he, when they came out, he bought the top of the line for both models. And then he could not figure out for the life of him which one to return. So he kept them both.

Wow. So they stumped him. Finally, they gave him too much at once.

See what— see what happens when an artist plays with fire? You get burned. You're like, I'm just going to buy all these phones and return all the ones I don't want. And then you're like, oh my God, I can't pick.

That's actually really—

you say artist or artist? Artist.

Door number 2, brother man.

Okay.

Door number 2. All right. So you're all right. So you're okay. So Joni Mitchell plays this, but why wouldn't Joni Mitchell just play an Epiphone or something? Look cool. Like a hollow body. Is that still heavier?

This is the lightest. This is the absolute lightest. Like, if you saw this guitar, Chris, you'd be like, this guitar looks freakish, but it's incredibly light.

Interesting. That is interesting. I— because it's, it's, it feels like something people would choose for stylistic reasons, but the lightness is what's bringing Joni to the table.

Yes, yes. So yeah, which brings me to when I was like 14, I really wanted a Les Paul because my favorite guitar players— get ready for this— were Joe Perry from Aerosmith.

Okay.

Living it up while it's going down.

And Jimmy Page. And they both were Les Paul.

You were on your white boy. You were on your suburban white boy swag. 100, 100.

For our non-guitar listeners at home, Les Paul's a heavy axe.

I am not a suburbs person, Chris. Please don't lump me in with that group. I've always lived in a city since childhood. I was born in Washington, D.C.

I've lived in a city since childhood.

I'm a— No, I am. Actually, today I was really feeling it. I mean, I'm a person who loves cities.

I'm with you, bro. I'm with you. I'm with you.

Okay, so he's city maxing. He's— he loves buildings.

So me and my dad at 14, we go to this— we go to this guitar store called Chuck Levin's, which is in Maryland. It's in like—

great name.

It's in like Wheaton, Maryland, somewhere real. It's out there.

Okay, so you are a big city dweller. I stand corrected.

Go ahead.

And I'm like, I'm like, what is the cheapest Les Paul that you guys have? And it's this 1980 black Les Paul with like this yellow binding. It's been yellowed from like nicotine. It's been so fucked up and it's a solid mahogany body. The thing weighs like 30, 40 pounds. It is crazy. But it also has the word second, like first, second, second written on the headstock, on the back of the headstock. And if you don't know what that means, it means it should not have left the factory. There was some flaw. It was maybe a minor flaw, but there was some flaw. It shouldn't have left the factory.

Anyways, irregular item.

This guitar, if I ever played it on a stage, it would probably give me like back trouble for life. But it was a secret weapon. We used it on the first Vampire Weekend record. Almost all of the electric guitar on that is that Les Paul from 1980. Gibson second mahogany, and because the wood is so dense, it has great sustain.

Oh, okay.

All right, can you listen? Can you explain what that means to our, uh, lesser-knowing listeners?

Well, okay, so the wood is like the mahogany is really heavy wood and really dense wood. It's like because of that, when you play a note, it rings out long and it just has a beautiful mellow tone.

We love that.

Anyways.

But you were in the lab sitting down with that shit under your lap like a baby. You couldn't be rocking out with it.

No, it was not a good— Yeah, it was not a good guitar. I think the one time I played it on a stage, was in 8th grade where we did— do you guys remember the All About the Benjamins rock remix?

Of course, yes.

We did a live performance of that with like, it was like a ragtag crew of us and we did a very, very authentic recreation of All About the Benjamins rock remix. Jason's gotta, gotta play that for our audience if you can.

Yeah, it's all about the Benjamins, rock remix featuring Lil' Kim and the Lox. Wow, it's called— it's known as the Shot Caller Rock Remix.

That's a, that's a great use of the One Time on stage with that guitar. That's like number— because the Les Paul, the Les Paul and the SG were the most popular hardcore guitars. Oh, and that was like a— those were very— right, Jason, was there? Because No one played like Telecasters and Stratocasters were not part of that. It was very much Les Paul SG.

Yeah, way too gay. It was Les Paul SG. And then also you would get some like Freaky Jackson or Ibanez, like, yeah, metal, like reverse headstock, you know, like crazy.

Apparently Rivers Cuomo, like, he actually plays Gibson guitars on his records, but he doesn't like the way they look, so he has like other more like Strat-looking, metal-looking guitars for stage, but he prefers the way the Gibsons sound.

Yeah, this reminds me of when I found out that professional tennis players, like, their rackets look like the model we can buy, but they're completely different specifications because they're so much heavier because they have so much power. Yes, they usually play a racket like the actual specs or like the racket they play when they were like 15. That's because that's like what they got used to.

It sounds similar to that or similar to how when you're doing the pull-ups with the 45-pound plate around your waist, it says 45 on there. But if you put on the scale, it's more like—

No, actually, I, I actually, you know what, the vests. Yeah, that's where I really pulled. I took my game up with using the vest.

Weighted vest.

I have a 45-pound weight vest.

That's big.

All right. So you're, you're telling me you're pulling up to Equinox, you're pulling up, you're pulling up to Equinox in the Porsche and you pop the trunk and you get that, that out, bro. You put, you reach in the convertible, it's in the back seat. You just get out, reach in, you pull the 45 out.

Well, interestingly, I started working. I start, it's, I started working out at a gym that's very close to my house that I won't reveal what other notable people work out at this gym, but it's a low-key gym. It's a local gym. And I don't work out with a trainer anymore.

You just go— you just go to this local celebrity— celebrity safe gym.

Is it Rodeo or is it Pharaoh's? Rodeo or Pharaoh's?

I'm not—

we'll bleep it. We'll bleep it, honey.

Pharaoh's is gay only. So Rodeo might be— they like— do they allow women?

It's very queer. It's very queer-coded.

Yeah. Most gyms are queer-coded. Yeah.

I mean, yeah.

Thank you for letting us invade that space. Some more than others.

Speaking of the— speaking of the queer coding, I got— I've been invading everyone's Reels economy and I did this letterboxed where they transcribed the words queer coding as queer coating, like C-O-A-T-I-N-G.

Yeah, I got a word for that too, but it's C-U-M is what I— is how I spell it. So it's a little different.

That comes right after the glazing process.

That's actually, that's really funny. Yeah.

I've been queer coated.

Exactly.

You've been going, you've been going.

It kind of smells like that one tree.

You've been going, you've been going hard in the paint. I have to say, I haven't seen this much Rossim content in years besides in our group chat or, you know, a text message.

Yeah. A quick round of applause for your PR team. You really hit every tech hole.

Yeah. Give a shout out. Give a shout out to her.

I mean, hopefully it's just getting started. You know, like we're, we're, the plane's about to take off. You know, we're still on the runway.

This is lap 1 of the marathon.

How much Rossim can we take? That's the question, America. You know what I mean? Sit down.

Well, I think we've reached the limit now that I know Jason.

Jason's about it for me. Oh, Jason being slightly dickish on how long I got.

Not Jason being slightly dickish on how long I'm on.

Let's get the program. Let's get the clips going, bro. Let's farm it.

Yeah, we got Letterboxd, Subway takes. What else are we doing? House tour yet?

Wait, what's—

What's your body count?

What's house tour? I don't know if I don't know if that's for me.

Where I go up to you on the street and I'm like, 'Hey, how much do you pay for rent?' And you're like, 'Actually, I own.' 'You want to come check it out?' You're like, 'Whoa, this studio is sick.

Really good natural lighting.' Y'all are funny.

I don't know if I want to do that. I don't want to— I don't know if I want to do that. I don't know if I want people—

don't do that, right?

You don't— you don't want those— you don't want those Clairo freaks knowing where you live. That you might get doxxed by some Clairo heads. You got to be careful, period.

I think her— I think her fans are pretty chill people from what I—

There's just a lot of them. That's all I'm saying.

By and large. But when you're— when you're that big of an artist, there's always going to be some freaks, you know, freaky snakes in the grass.

People collect. But you— have you been having fun?

Yeah. I mean, it's interesting because in this day and age, it does seem like what— how people consume stuff is with vertical videos and like the stuff that's coming out about podcasts, like like, like people like going up to hosts of podcasts being like, I'm such a big fan of your podcast. And then it comes out, he's like, oh no, I don't listen to it. I just watch the clips. Yeah, but like, that's maybe a little bit more of the reality. So it's like, yeah, you can get this amazing profile with Amanda Petrušić in The New Yorker and go deep about like how lyrics can change with a different melody and like, but—

or I mean, that's the voice of the world, not us. Amanda's an amazing writer. We love her. A great How Long Gone guest.

We— yes. So we, we need— me and Amanda need to like make some vertical videos together basically if we want to reach the maximum number of people. But, but, but yes, it's been, it's been fun to like, you know, pop out different in 2026.

I look, I agree.

And I think that your boy popping out different. He acting different.

I told you he was on the Drake album. I told you. I knew he'd been hiding it. Okay.

So do you like that you can go along with How Long Gone or a New Yorker profile for those of us who still have an attention span that hasn't been, you know, severed off at the root or—

No, no.

You know, is it a bummer that I like you guys?

This is fun. I think it'd be fun for us to do some kind of vertical video type shit down the line. Remember, remember when I suggested Rostam Week on How Long Gone?

We could— No, we would love to pull Rostam Week. Look, we're down when the—

when the— Rostam Week. It was a cute pitch.

When the schedule's lined up.

But are you guys going to pivot to vertical video? What's up with that?

Well, we're filming video stuff that's going to live horizontally like a standard YouTube video. But, you know, the idea and the goal is to clip that out into, you know, if it's a half an hour video of us talking shit, you know, maybe get, you know, 6 to 10 clips out of that that'll go video and, you know, spread the good seed of How Long Gone throughout the nation.

It's just, it's just It's just sort of like it's, it's a lot more work, like a lot more work.

No, I get that.

And I, but I also, I think the benefit, I think the benefit, it's obvious that it works. It's not like, it's like, it's not your, you're not shouting into the void. If you spend the time and effort to do it, I do think it works, especially when you're in our position, you're somewhat established. It's not like we're starting from scratch.

For those who are just listening to this and can't enjoy the video feed, Chris is lying down on a bed. He's got two comfortable pillows behind him. He's got his laptop seemingly on his lap.

It's on a pillow on my lap. I gotta protect the stuff, you know what I'm saying?

Oh, okay.

And he's got, he's got his AirPod Max, those big Apple headphones that I do not fuck with. And he's holding a microphone. He's got a nice foam pop filter on that microphone. It's a very professional setup over here.

Give me a beat, Rossum. Give me a beat. I'm ready, bro.

Give me a beat.

I've never done, I've never used a mic stand on How Long Gone in my entire life.

Okay.

I've never— I always do it like this, and I don't know if it's better or worse. It's probably more annoying for Jason, but I always do it like this because I'm usually somewhere. I'm rarely at home, I guess.

Actually, this is good. While I have both of you all here in a safe space, in a couples therapy kind of way, Rasmus, you're a producer of music. You've recorded a lot of people's vocals over the years.

True.

You know, professional singers, the Claires of the world. What do you do when the person vocalizing can't keep the distance of the mic from their mouth in a consistent distance?

What do you do?

Is there a trick or a tip?

I would use a multiband compressor. The one that I like the most is made by McDSP, MCDSP, and it's the M404. You'll get amazing results.

Because look, I'm just like Danielle from Hype. When I hit the high note, I pull back. You know what I'm saying? I just pull back a little bit. That's what we got to do. That's what my vocal coach tells me.

Well, the problem is when you hit the high note is not the issue. It's your low note because your voice has a lower frequency. Sometimes, you know, sometimes we lose a lot of dynamic range when you get excited.

I see.

So I'll be looking at the waveform and everything's looking all nice and perfect. I say one of my classic hilarious TJ lines. It's just a black bar of audio. It's just, it's clipping, it's limiting, it's all messed up. It's flattering to me because I'm getting such a great response out of you. But, you know, it's tough. Oh, I mean, I'm riding the volume for the whole hour.

Yes, you got it right. Yeah, I get it. I get it. Chris is a very dynamic— he's dynamic. That's called dynamic range.

That's how that's described. Yeah, that's really how I'm described, often described as dynamic. Thank you for that plug-in tip. I was hoping we were going to get a few from you for free out of this, you know what I mean?

Of course.

Because you've done one of those, like you did like the breakdown, the song. What's the popular thing where it's like real studio mix with the masters?

These two French guys.

Yes. Yeah.

In Paris.

How gnarly do they get?

Listen, I feel like it's fun to make those videos knowing that the people who are going to watch them are people who do this day in and day out.

And like, yeah, like, don't understand it.

You don't have to hold back. You can like show the plugin and show how you adjusted the settings. And, you know, you like want to learn. Everybody, everybody in that, in that game wants to learn more from other producers.

And yeah, we had, we had, um, we were talking with, um, Um, I'm gonna mispronounce his name. Jason, can you say it?

Uh, as soon as you tell me who it is.

Uh, Song Exploder. Song.

Oh, oh, Rishi. Rishi Kesh.

Rishi Kesh. I, I said it right the whole episode and then I just blanked. But, um, and he was great and I really like him. I really like that show. But he was actually telling us that sometimes the artist will get emotional hearing the stem because they, they've almost haven't heard it in so long, or maybe have never heard it. Yeah, like a raw vocal or something. And I've— have you ever? Because that's fascinating to me. And I feel like that is a very rare experience.

I've had the experience of being like, oh wait, what the fuck did I put in this session? Like, oh Jesus, this doesn't even make sense. But like, it's kind of working.

Like, yeah, yeah, sure, sure.

Piano's playing different chords than the guitar, but I like it.

Yeah, we just kind of duck the volume on those a little bit.

I'm going to give you some real crazy information about Rishikesh and the song Jealous Guy by John Lennon. John Lennon actually started writing that song on a trip to India with the Beatles.

Okay.

But he didn't finish it until after the Beatles. But the original version, the first lyric was, on the road to Rishikesh, I was dreaming more or less. On the road to Rishikesh, Oh yes, I was dreaming more or less.

Damn, Rishikesh, a podcaster and a place.

Yes, I believe so.

Wow, that is actually great. I feel like the crossover of people who understand that or knew that is you, you know, and maybe him and his dad.

And yeah, there's a lot of Beatles.

And you have a beautiful voice. Very—

a lot of Beatles super fans out there.

Oh yeah, I know that. That's true. It's just like, yeah, you're not going to get doxxed if you like John too much. Luckily, the stans Stay away. It's a different culture.

I am a John. I'm a John person. Let's put that on the record. I don't, I don't know if I'm, I'm not really a Paul guy.

I'm a George guy.

I'm a, yeah, we're George people on this pod.

I love him.

George Harrison's solo album, best by far to me, like untouchable.

He's the John Frusciante of the Beatles. He's low-key beasting. His tones and his melodies are insane. He, he sits back in the cut, long hair, probably hung, uncut. He's looking good.

Apparently when Coldplay was finishing A Rush of Blood to the Head, they had some— someone who's like very close to them in their team who played Chris Martin "Isn't It a Pity," which is from that album All Things Must Pass.

Yeah.

And he, and he was like, can you, Chris, maybe write a song like this? And it's like that, those kind of like simple piano chords, like dun dun dun.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And then Chris wrote The Scientist. It was like one of the last songs for A Rush of Blood.

Oh, hell no, not The Scientist. You're gonna get Jason and I to crying if you start talking about the scientist. That's an all-timer right there.

Let me fire up my Soul Seek. Here I go.

But I love the idea. I love the idea of somebody being like, hey, could you just write a song like this great George Harrison song for the album before we finish?

Could you just try— found this old record, we can use it as a reference track. All Things Pass.

Yeah, why don't you try this just before we close up?

George Harrison. Okay, I'll give it a try.

Like, yeah, like the story with Russian Blood to the Head is apparently felt like they were close to done with the album and at the last minute, 11th hour, Chris writes Clocks and The Scientist.

Whoa.

They were like, last minute.

Really?

Yes.

That's like Benny Blanco with California Girls.

Same.

We thought this thing was in the can. And then Benny said, what if it went this? Duh duh duh duh duh duh. And they're like, what the fuck?

I mean, that is, that is, I mean, And getting told that at the last minute and being able to pull it out, I mean, that's why Chris Martin's one of the greats, you know, besides his shirt, besides his t-shirts. He's one of the greats.

Hold this clock really quick. I gotta go buy another fucking yacht right now.

Okay, let's talk about, let's talk about cropping shirts because this is something I've gotten recently into.

Pause.

There's a guy in the Lower East Side. His name is Ramon. He only takes cash.

Bro, you don't, you don't think I know Ramon?

I know, but I want the people to know because Ramon is special. Is he verse?

How does it work? Yeah, he's, he's, he's old school.

School. He's basically, he's kind of retired now, Ross, to be fair. I don't think he's touching much. You know what I mean? I think he's run the operation.

Retired Ramon.

Boss style. But he's in there and his daughter runs the business. She's great.

Yeah. So one thing that I love is to buy like a Comme des Garçons shirt. I've done this a couple times now. I take it to Ramon.

Yeah.

You take the garçon to Ramon?

I take the Comme to Ramon and I just get him to take an inch off. Oh, okay.

Yeah.

Lil Yachty, Lil Yachty bar.

Take, take, take an inch off the bottom, and the shit is fitting me in a next level way. I don't have to worry about tucking or being untucked. There's no, there's no, um, there's no tucking versus untucking drama in my life. No dilemma. There's no dilemma there. It's just, I, I feel good. Like, I can—

there's no more tucking drama in your life. The doll has had a successful surgery. We are on the other side of You know, I can tuck.

I like to do a French tuck sometimes.

Oh, I know you do. I know you do.

I think the height of your torso and the way clothes are cut, you're saying your body is kind of a tweener where it like it sits right in between. Will it tuck? Should it untuck? And Ramon says problem solved. Now everything is perfect.

I think just in general, I don't like a full tuck. I've never been a full tuck liker.

You know, it can be restricting, but I do like it. When duty calls. I wouldn't do it on like a Monday afternoon, you know what I mean? But I think that there's a— with a jacket, with a suit, without a jacket, it can be tough because you'll wear a shirt untucked with a blazer, which I think looks cool for other people. But I cannot do that. I feel like I'm like committing a crime against like preppy culture.

Something that horrific is cute for you, but I would never.

And that's how I feel about loafers.

Yeah, no, I know.

I know.

Period. That's what I'm saying.

Loafers, period.

Rossum said loafers are way too gay even for me, period.

Well, I mean, I think that—

I didn't talk about the chunky Pradas. He's talking about the bass, regular shit.

You don't want to get into a footwear battle with me, but go ahead. Go ahead.

No, I'm joking.

Yeah, Rostam, what do you tell— could you expand more on your thoughts about loafers?

This episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by a new podcast from The Guardian, Stateside with Kai and Carter. This is covering a lot of our bases, Jason. It's a It's trying to slow down the news and wrestle with the questions we all have about what's happening in the world. And I know you particularly have quite a lot of questions.

A lot of questions. But how often? Because we do this podcast 3 times a week, and that's a sweet spot. How many times do they do?

3 times a week. And I, I have a feeling, just based on the platform and these talking points, that they're maybe going to be covering different stuff than we do. That's just a guess.

The Guardian is not some billionaire-owned platform. They're not afraid to say what they want to say, brother.

Yeah, Rupert ain't sniffing around in, in what, uh, journalism what else Kai Wright and Carter Sherman are up to over there at Stateside. But yeah, listen wherever you get your podcasts. You can watch on YouTube. It's 3 times a week. And, and who couldn't use more news, you know, especially, especially when it's, when it's not, you know, from here, let's say. Give it, give it a listen. Give it a listen.

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See store online for details. I just feel like there's like a lot of like white guys with hairy legs and like wearing like no-show socks with loafers, and it's like a weird scene. It's like very like Georgetown University circa 1999.

Hey, don't you look— your, your, your sexual trauma around white guys with hairy legs is not my problem. Okay, bro, that is your— that's— I'm sorry what he did to you, but that's not my problem.

You can fuck him now. Go right these wrongs, Ross. All these guys that wouldn't give you the time of day.

I got no trauma. I just, I just feel like there's cooler things that you could like. You guys know I like a little bit of preppy style here and there. Like, I just feel like there's cooler things that you could do than wear loafers, you know?

Oh, it's not about, but it's not, to me, it's not about cool or not. It's about the, it's the most traditional and functional shoe in the closet. That's, it's not about, it's the easiest, slip it on.

The operative part of that sentence being in the closet. Goddammit.

Yeah, it's giving operative.

You are right.

Oh, he gave it, he gave it to those How Long Gone boys. He gave it to, he fed them back.

Okay, slow down, slow down. So yeah, this kitten's got claws. How do you feel about a pleats, please, Rostam?

I think some of the shit is dope and some of the shit is not dope. When people— I got to say something very controversial.

Fair.

I think I rarely like it when a suit and pants match. I think it's a very weird look.

You mean with pleats, please, in particular?

Yes. Yeah. When people wear the full suit with pleats, pleats, please. I— it crosses some kind of line. Like, I want— like, if you're gonna do it, then switch up the pant color.

That reminds me, it's a little bit— it's a little bit of the, the white boy version of the jersey match the hat match the shoes. Oh God, I mean, like Nelly era, you know what I'm saying? It's like, it feels like that to me. But I think pleats, please on men is really tough. Really tough.

It depends how you put it together, right, Chris? It's all about context.

You put— you get a nice gray pleats, please top and bottom matching, a nice white McQueen sneaker on bottom, little no-show.

You had—

you have a funky Sunday look.

You have a funky little pleats please hat, I feel like, that is a wild piece of clothing that you somehow pull off. Because if I saw it on the shelf, I'd be walking the other way. But it does— I got it.

I had a moment with those hats. I got them in a few different colors. I got my mom one because my mom is who got me into Issey Miyake. Like, she— that's like her shit. She loves Issey.

It's great. It's the ultimate— Alex's mom is into that too. It's the ultimate mom to me, like a mom with taste. That's the ultimate brand.

There we go. Moms with taste. Hashtag moms.

It really is.

Hashtag yummy mommy.

This mommy tastes good.

Yes, exactly that part. But, um, okay. But yeah, I feel you. I think, I think one, one component of an outfit being pleats, please, can, can work nicely.

How much were the hats running for? How much were the hats running for? Because I know you're a guy that buys multiples. You're a, if I like it, I'm getting every color type of cat.

There's only a couple things I feel that way about, and Visvim is one of those things.

And, uh, what's the hoodie you've been wearing? Probably with the, with the strings. That's Visvim, right?

Okay. So here I'm gonna go deep with y'all on this one.

Did you custom the strings? Don't tell me you custom the strings.

You're going, he's going Emil Haney on us right now.

You were, you're going Emil on us right now. Hard body.

The strings are from, you know how like now nowadays with with high-end shoes, they're giving you two sets of laces, right?

Of course.

So the strings that I'm putting in these Visvim hoodies, and they actually come with no string. They're just—

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

They come stringless. Chris knows about this because he's been researching hoodies for Hanover.

Yeah, honestly, I know a lot about hoodies and I don't even wear them that much.

Okay, so I use the alternate shoelaces that you get with these APC white white leather sneakers.

You've done this twice?

Yes.

Wow. Okay. And you— so you take it to Ramon and you're like, weave this in for me?

Actually, Laura, who's my housekeeper, she was able to do it. I, I never— I don't know how, but she did it. I asked if she could.

I said, give it to me.

I said, I, I said, Laura, could you help? And then the next thing I knew, she made it happen. I don't know how she made it happen.

That's actually cool because that feels like something that is oddly compli— like when the string comes out of the workout shorts, I'm, I'm, I can't, I can't put that back.

This is the thing though, you can just look on any online anywhere and there's, there's a way to— I think you can get like a long coat hanger, a coat hanger, a long pen or a pencil and just kind of boom and stick it through, weave it through. But what about these white shoelaces on the Apece sneakers? Are they different than just a standard white?

No, they look like climbing, they look like climbing rope.

Yeah, they have like a navy sort of wraparound pattern, like a subtle navy.

Okay.

Okay.

You— wow, you're really getting it custom. That's, that's a lot. That's a lot of work.

What, to be cropping the shirts and—

well, I've cropped one t-shirt cuz it was too long and I got it back and I was like, I fucking hate this. I'm never doing this again. I just— it didn't— it was wrong. As soon as I got it back, I was like, this doesn't fit. And it was an amazing Counting Crows, amazing Counting Crows shirt. And unfortunately, You know, you look August and everything after, white with black print, simple, nothing on the back. Chris, let's go sit in the archive.

Let's discuss. Maybe, maybe there's a, maybe there's a 5'9" King that would fit perfectly.

And you're okay. I didn't know, do you respect the Crows? I don't know that about you.

Oh yeah, but I have not seen the doc yet. But I mean, when I went to the first guitar teacher I ever had had actually kind of my only guitar teacher. His name was Eric Ulrich. I asked him to teach me 4 songs on the first guitar lesson. One of them was Mr. Jones by the Counting Crows.

Classic.

One of them was High and Dry by Radiohead. Oh, one of them was Machine Head by Bush.

Better than the rest.

That shit slaps. That Machine Head, he's been playing it too, and it kind of still slaps.

And the fourth one I feel like maybe the fourth one was one he wanted me to learn, which was an Eric Clapton song that had bends in it. And he was like, this is a good song for you to learn because you'll learn the bends. What's that song called? It's Wonderful Tonight.

You weren't— because you weren't Clapton proficient. That wasn't your shit.

I liked some Clapton, but like, yeah, he like expanded my taste a little bit. The guitar teacher, he was getting me into more like guitar stuff. Stuff. Girl from Ipanema, uh, Little Wing by Hendrix. There's— he was like, I'm gonna teach you everything you want to learn, but then you should learn a few things that I want you to learn.

Yeah, two for you, one for me type shit. That's fair.

You said, okay, sensei, let's do this.

The Counting Crows renaissance I was hoping for is— it feels stalled. I was really on— I, I was really pushing the narrative and the documentary. The thing about the documentary is, and, and this is unfortunate, nothing happens really. Like, the rise to fame is pretty crazy and they're so normal, but then like there's no OD, nobody dies, they still get along. It's just sort of like boring.

I have a treacherous—

your dreads were fake.

I have a treacherous question, which is what is Adam Durrance's ethnicity?

That's that, you know, we ain't answering that. I don't know. White, bro. He's from San Francisco. I mean, there might be some Spanish. Jason, look it up. I think there might be some like looking it up.

He's a white, half white and Russian Jewish.

Okay.

Born in Baltimore, Maryland. Reformed in a— raised in a Reform Jewish household.

The story—

Rabbi Jones and me, he said.

The best story in the documentary is when he gets really famous, he kind of starts to feel like crazy living in Berkeley and he moves to LA and sort of like works at the Viper Room as a bartender to like give himself some like like normalcy. And then it's like the first night there, it's like Kate Moss's birthday and he's hanging out. And then Johnny Depp's like his best friend. That shit's cool. But like, there's no tragedy. I want tragedy. For better or worse, I want tragedy.

I want something bad to happen to you.

In a rock doc.

But also, I just looked it up. The very first line on the song Mr. Jones, he famously references his cultural background. First line, I'm a Russian Jew American impersonating African.

Wait, that's not the first line of it. It's down at the New Amsterdam. Yeah, I was talking to this yellow-haired girl.

Okay, sorry, sorry, sorry. Not the first line. Not the first line. It was, but it's in that. It is a lyric in Mr. Joe.

That, that is very verbose for a lyric.

I don't remember that.

I could be wrong.

I mean, I don't know if I know every word, but I feel like I, if I, yeah.

Okay, wait, sorry. I looked it up. It says that famous lyric is from the song 1492. This is AI being wrong again, you motherfuckers.

1492. I'm not from, I'm not familiar with that. But because Mr. Jones is the biggest hit by far, I, I think— oh no, actually the Joni Mitchell cover is the biggest, biggest.

That makes sense. That was a very TRL era.

It was from a movie too. It was like a movie soundtrack thing. Yeah, because Vanessa sang on that. Vanessa Carlton sang on that.

Did you guys used to watch TRL, bro?

Are you kidding me? I fucking— I lived it, bro. Cartel, we did TRL a handful of times. It was my favorite thing in the world.

Wow, that's cool. I didn't know that.

So it was so— it was so sick because it would be like you backstage with your homies, and then it's like the other guests are Soulja Boy and Natalie Portman or some shit, and everybody's just kind of hanging out together. It was just a very different time.

Wait, Jason, since you're looking stuff up, what was the— what was the date range of TRL? It was like, what, '95 to 2005, or—

it feels later. It feels later.

It feels '98 to 2006.

1998 to 2008.

Oh, wow.

Obviously the last few years it would kind of, you know, fizzling out. But I think, you know, the hot—

the sweet spot was right around, you know, this sweet spot was like boy band prime, like Backstreet Boys, NSYNC, like that era was the prime. And we— you could cheat, you know what I mean? You could pay the way that— the way that all these bands are paying for the clip farms, we would pay for a voting farm.

Oh shit.

That's how Trump won the election.

Exactly. Same thing. Same kind of thing. You would just— you basically like— I would have to— I mean, I don't know, maybe I should save this, but basically we would you would— you would— the label would— I would have to pay, and then the label would— I would invoice the label for some, like, innocuous fees, and they would pay me because they couldn't have the paper trail. But that's like a pot— that was like a very known thing.

Wow.

It was like the payola thing, you know? It was the same kind of thing.

Marketing expense.

Yeah, it was just a classic marketing expense. Classic marketing.

Wow.

But I, I think that that— now that that's happening for, you know, every person on Earth, it seems—

when you say, Chris, when you say you want to save it, do you mean you want to save it for your book.

No, I just feel like, I feel like I'm like, have we ever talked about this before? Is this bad for me to say? But then I don't really, I mean, whatever. It's not, I think this is a pretty common practice.

Enough time has passed.

How is the book coming along?

Oh, great question, Rostam. I love to talk about this.

Um, I can't tell, are you being sarcastic?

Yes, I'm being sarcastic. No, it's fine. It's actually fine. I, I just am, I think it's, I said this to, I think I've said this to Jason before, or maybe I've said, it's, it's the troubling thing And maybe this isn't dissimilar to making an album, but you're sort of like, you finish all the stuff you got to do during the day, like, oh, I ran my errands, I went to the gym, I responded to all my emails, we recorded How Long Gone, but you're never really done because that shit is looming over your head no matter what. No matter how much you accomplish in a day, you didn't do the thing that is the most, you know, that's the, the North Star, the most—

you know, as they say, Chris, with the AI discourse, don't be a rider if you don't like riding, you know what I mean?

Yeah, no, it's real.

I mean, you got to learn how to It.

One thing that could work maybe is what if you inverse that order and you try to do the writing right at the top of the morning? Just like, yeah, a lot, a lot of people.

No, a lot of people do that. A lot of people do that. It's just, and I think that is valuable. I think that's probably a valuable approach. I just think that would throw off my shit so much that I like don't even know. I don't know how long it would take me to acclimate to that for it to be positive. You know what I mean?

Throw that shit off, brother. Throw it off.

Yeah, I probably need to throw it off.

Yeah. You work out in the afternoon until you finish a book. It's fine. Then you can go back.

Working out in the afternoon unfortunately is, is one of the most diabolical things that people can do. It fucks me up so bad. It fucks me up so bad because I, I also need to work.

I'm one of those people, I have to work out on a totally empty stomach. I cannot have food.

Same. Unless I've like traveled and I have no choice. I'm, I'm with you. And you can't— I can't not eat till 3 PM. Also, Jason, that's, that's promoter, that's promoter. That 3 PM hour is like the, the darkest people on Earth are in the gym.

Okay, so I don't, I don't go, I don't go to the gym to look at other people, Chris. I go there to kind of do work on myself.

I'm not looking, I'm not looking at other people. I'm saying the energy you feel is different. It's like these, like, this is a different vibe at 3 PM. Like, 8 AM is when you're in there with the people that are like getting after it. 3 PM is like, no offense to my photographers, you know, that's when I see Kobe. That's why I see people I know and I'm like, oh yeah, you guys, you guys are talking to a 3 PM motherfucker. You're on demon time.

You're getting bodied by a 3 PMer, Chris.

All right, let's go, let's go slightly deep on, on working out stuff. So do you work out with the trainer still or no? Are you solo?

Only when I'm in LA.

Okay. So in New York you're solo and you like the Equinox on Prince Street or another one?

No, Tribeca now is closer.

Oh, Chai-Becca.

Chai-Becca. And I would say less populated, I would say.

I have an update for you. I went to a club last night that was like right across the park from—

Are you talking about, what's it called?

Gosh.

Gosh. Yes. Gosh, Jason, New York's hottest club is Gosh.

It really is. Okay. Wait, wait, wait. Let's finish.

The workout and then I want to do a deep gosh dive.

Okay. Oh, yeah. Because I want to hear about Jason. Jason, are you, are you Equinox Glendale?

No, I canceled my Equinox, I would say maybe a year, year and a half ago. And I work out at home and then I do Pilates twice a week. So I sort of switched my like nice outdoor group fitness that costs money from Equinox to Pilates.

I find now I only use Equinox in New York. So am I going to have— maybe I might switch my membership because when I'm in L.A., I just don't go. I just don't bother with it.

If you're going to the places I'm going, it's there. It's— you can't really beat it. What's for the— like, I don't—

what's the place you like in LA? It's like Easton or something.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Rossum, you're more of a High Matt guy. You're a bougie bitch. You pull up in the fucking Porsche.

I tried. I tried High Matt. I tried High Matt. And the drive was just very brutal. It was like the worst drive you could imagine. That's far on Santa Monica. Santa Monica Boulevard in the middle of the day or middle of the morning is just— it's never pretty, you know? It's never— it's always trafficky.

So you want Spencer Pratt to clean that street up is what you're saying?

Yeah, exactly.

Oh gosh.

Oh my gosh.

The most Rossum response you could ever say.

Oh gosh. Yeah, but I also— I don't really touch the West Side in LA. Like, I don't touch them. I don't even touch Hollywood. Like, to me, the West Side is everything west of the Arclight, which doesn't exist anymore, which is crazy. But the Arclight used to be my—

like, that's as far as the train goes.

I really want the Arclight to reopen. I really— I feel like that's part of when, when LA started going downhill, when we lost the Arclight.

I think Spencer could bring that back too. I think Spencer could bring that back too.

If Spencer ran on that Save the Arclight platform, you would vote?

No, no, no, no, no, no.

Brett Ratner is gonna buy it, and then they're gonna get— they'll do it together.

No, Brett, Brett, I want that Arclight back.

They're gonna get this thing back on its feet. What do you mean? I don't see a problem here.

They only play Milano.

Let's get that. I have so many memories of the Arclight. I mean, it's just such a beautiful space, so many good theaters.

It was really like a gathering place where every class type neighborhood all came together. Famous celebs, random poor people, every person, all walks of life, all came together in that one lobby. They had the caramel corn and we all enjoyed a film together. And then COVID came and ruined it all.

I have a friend who has a theory that—

And now hantavirus is about to kill it for the second time.

That LA never recovered from the pandemic, but New York did.

I think that's not an unpopular theory.

What do you guys think?

I've heard that before too.

Jason, you just spent a week in New York.

As a bicoastal podcaster, I have thoughts on this. But yeah, I think because New York, with everyone, everyone wants to be out all the time. Everyone's having their meals outside. Everyone's going out and doing things every day. You're leaving the— your small abode to explore the world. The city is where you live, so it had to get back to work. Whereas LA, you can just get your little PPP loan check and never come down the hill from Laurel Canyon and order your Goop kitchen, and you know, we're all good. I don't need to go— there's no cool clubs to go to in LA outside of a few random, you know, warehouse things downtown. There's no social culture happening in LA anymore except for group fitness class.

Houses. No, don't say that. There's several wine bars where you can sit outside. There's several. 8 I can think of by name.

I did it last night. I went to Stir Crazy last night. Our friends from Rita's, the restaurant in London, Missy and Gabe, they did a pop-up. And who was there but Adele and Rich Paul, Lil Rich.

Oh wow, that's big.

Amazing.

That's big. I've never seen Adele IRL.

Yeah, I, I've never talked about this, but I did write 2 songs with Adele in 2015, and we never finished them. I've never talked about this.

Damn, because Tobias Jesso Jr. came in there with the elbow. He said, excuse me, sir.

Not at all, not at all, okay? Not at all. Because I love to— I love Tobias. He's, uh, he's amazing.

I didn't know he— I didn't know he worked on your record until I was reading press.

But one thing about Adele I gotta tell you guys is like, she's so the real deal. And like, she's— she played Someone Like You on guitar for like, just— she's the real— she, like, can write— she can write a song backwards, forwards. She's the real thing. Everything she— her problem is that everything she sings sounds like a classic song. Like, it sounds like it's existed forever as soon as—

oh, you can't— you can't tell because there's too many. It's just too good. I mean, I remember when Emile worked with her, he told me, he was like, that's the craziest shit I've ever seen. I've never, like, just come, like, blow you away. Yes, like chills, vocal, like, just like whatever. I can sit down, I can lay down, I can stand up, it's gonna sound good no matter what. It's pretty crazy. It's pretty crazy. Yeah.

She's an amazing person.

And Scott Storch of the vocal booth, we get it, you guys.

Exactly. Where is the— where are the songs? Which, which Rostam hard drive we got to go through, bro?

No, no, no. They'll, they'll see the light of day if ever she wanted to finish them. Of course I'm down to— or maybe our paths will cross. Life is long. But I, but I keep shit locked. I keep shit locked tight.

How much unfinished— how much unfinished shit do you have? Like, I, I'm— it's, it's so surprising to me that you'll do, like, spend a week with someone and they're a— it's like ideas, but there's nothing like finished, finished.

I don't know, not that much. I don't— or I actually, I don't know. I don't know. Maybe if I were to like really look at it, I'm like, oh, I did a song with that person. Jesus.

Yeah, because I'm sure there's— I'm sure there were phases where it was like every week it's some, you know, some other shit, and it's like, oh, okay, I totally forgot about Shawn Mendes.

Uh, I never worked with Shawn, but I don't really do too much of that, like what people call, like, what do they call it, the conveyor belts or something?

Like, well, not anymore. I meant at one phase, I'm sure it was more like that.

It's interesting because when I moved to LA at the end of 2013, I really thought that I might pursue a career as, like, a pop producer, which is a thing that I don't think is really my path. But I've intersected with that life and I've done songs with pop artists in my career. But it's like more specific. It's— there's like a genre of pop artists like a Charli or Carly Rae that's also a writer. Or like an Adele, like, who's also a— like, also writes their songs. Like, those, those are kind of like a very specific cut of, of the pop world. And I— and I—

music that's good and listenable.

Don't say that.

But you also like money. You also like money. And that's where you can get a fucking nice little sink, right?

Uh-huh. He makes all his money with Hamilton. He doesn't even have to go to these pop shows. He can go to fucking he can go to Hamilton's house in the basement and they could do their little thing.

It's, it's Chris. 800 cars for kids. I think we got it.

Jason. Wait, I did see a weird thing about that today. Jason. Jason, I gotta say, I, I, I've, anytime I've ever like sniffed around, like, should I do this thing? Like, this'll be a pay, like, and I don't do those things cuz it doesn't really, it's just, it doesn't Doesn't— I don't think I've ever really gone all the way there. But if I've ever dipped in the toe of like, am I going to do this for them? It's not— nah, it's not good. I don't know. That's not how I— that's not how I can make money. It's like, I feel like I make money when I'm like so excited about something that I like go all the way in on it and it like consumes me. And maybe it's like an up-and-coming artist, but maybe it's just like whatever, something that I believe in.

Well, sometimes you're on Bring a Trailer and that G-Wagon pops up that you just got to have. And you say, you know what, Mr. Mendez, I will come to the studio this week.

You know what? Let me know. I'm fine. What is this new Apple show called? Sure.

But wait, let me put you guys on to something about being a producer. You know, you really have to finish the song before you send it, right? And you do not get paid. Paid for finishing the song until they want to put the song out.

Yeah, yeah, I know, I know. You're waiting, bro. You're always waiting.

So I just want to say, like, it's not what you think it is. And being a producer, like, you really have to— you, you have to put in the work because you believe in it.

You're telling me it's not like hip-hop? Maggie Rogers doesn't bring 50 bands over in a Louis duffel and just drop it off before you got— once you give her the beat tape? It doesn't work like that? Damn, you got me fucked up. I thought everybody— how much for a feature? We the— we the Rostem feature. I can do it for 10. I can do it for 10.

I'm in the lab with Molly Santana all week.

People, people do sometimes DM me and they're like, can I send you loops? And I'm just like, what do I do? What would I do with that?

You're like, bro, I make my own loops. That's the whole fucking thing, bro. That's my job. That's my whole fucking thing.

They want to be like, damn, Rostem said one of my loops was good.

All right, so when are you— you're going— you're about to hit the road, bro. I can't even imagine. Are you doing a sprinter? You getting a bus? What's the vibe?

We—

yeah, we have a bus. We have a like couple legs of different sections of the tour. I'm excited to play. I— my band is like fun to play with. We're like live where there's so much talent in the room. Like, these guys could like— they could like switch instruments in the middle of songs and like cover each other's parts.

That is nice. That is nice.

It's really fun. And I feel like— I guess maybe because I've been in the studio so much in the last 10 years, there's something really thrilling thrilling. I got to say, the word is thrilling about putting on a show that feels like something that you have not never seen before musically. Seeing like pedal steel, violin, real drums. Like, I don't know, I'm, I'm, I'm just excited about it. I think it's going to be fun.

When does the concert, when does the film come out?

We're figuring that out because, because there is a thing with YouTube where it's like if you drop a 30-minute YouTube, like it's kind of hard to get people to watch a 30-minute—

Yeah, no shit.

Okay. Yeah, no shit, bro.

The algorithm doesn't shine upon 30. They like 30 seconds, not 30 minutes.

Well, I think 30 seconds is a little short too, but—

Well, you know what I mean. You know what I mean, Rossman.

I think probably between now and the middle of next week, or between now and the tour, we'll drop the whole concert film.

It's really, it's really good. And it's— I like how you— my favorite part of it was when you had to show him that you could play drums for like 30 seconds. Jason, the whole thing, he's playing all these— he's walking around, and then there's, there's just a 30-second part where him and the drummer set up face to face, like playing at the same time. Like, this shit, I had to let him know. There's— I had to touch everything.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

He's like, I had to let him know.

That's really— that's me taking the advice from my manager, Dalton Sim, who is a legend and a wonderful, very wonderful man. Everyone who knows him and managed by him is like, this is the best manager. And I really love Dalton. He has said to me, he's like, I want to see you show your musicality. I want to see you show people how many instruments you can play.

Yeah, it's like Kid Rock. Kid Rock will do every instrument during one song. He'll do turntables, he'll do drums.

I actually did not know that.

I did not know that Kid Rock's really about that shit, bro. Kid Rock's got it. Don't, don't sleep on Kid because of his problem dramatic. He can breakdance too, Five Elements.

Have you guys ever seen a John Bryan live show?

Yes.

Uh, not, not in person, no.

He'll do a cool— he'll do a really cool thing where he'll sit at the drums and he's got it so dialed in with his sound man that he'll just start playing drums casual style, and his sound guy knows when to start the loop, or maybe he's doing it in a subtle way that you can't see.

Oh, that's cool.

So then he'll get the, the drums going, he'll get a loop going, and then he'll walk over to the piano, he'll do the same thing at the piano, and the next thing he picks up the guitar, the bass, and he's building a track live for you. That's, that's really next level.

So hey, I don't, I don't want to talk out of turn, but John Mayer was doing some shit like that at MSG, if I'm keeping it 100, with a, with a double neck. Okay, he had it, he was doing it with the double neck.

Also, if you just go to Santa Monica Promenade, there's 11 fuckers doing that too.

You ever heard of a little artist named Ed Sheeran, Rostam? I don't know about— he's a famous looper as well.

I actually—

it's not as sexy, but it's not as sexy as John Bryan, of course.

I actually did go to an Ed Sheeran show just because I kind of wanted to check it out. And I'm published by the same publishing company, which I love. Sony. Give it up for Sony. They're awesome.

But we give it up for our Sony fans.

We'll shop at a culvert called Sony. I'm just really loving them lately.

Actually, now, well, now they have new offices and studios on like Sycamore, which is like the cool street now, you know?

It's like, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, where all the cool stuff is happening over there.

But I love when cool stuff happens.

Shout out to Jacques-Marie Masche. Yeah, yeah, etc.

Yeah, by the Bodhi store. Um, oh yeah, and, and your fave store, Crazy Melrose. Is it Melrose Hill?

I guess no, that's not Melrose Hill.

That's more, that's more Melrose and Western, and this is more kind of La Brea-ish.

Yeah, yeah.

Okay, but here's what I gotta say about the Ed Sheeran show. There's these monitors, and I'm see— I'm looking at these. They're not— well, they're like, yeah, they're LCD walls, but they, they have a very specific shape, and And like, I'm trying to figure out what this shape is. I'm like watching the whole show.

The shape of you.

No, let me tell you. Let me tell you what the shape is. It took me a while, but I realized these LCD monitors and there's tons of them filling out SoFi Stadium. They're in the shape of guitar picks.

That's fire. Hell yeah. Ed's got taste. I knew it, bro. I knew what Ed was doing. Ed said, I'm like a Hard Rock Cafe. This whole fucking place. Don't test me.

Of all the shapes he went guitar pick, which is not even really It's just like a round triangle.

Yeah, that's not even identifiable by most people. You know what I mean? Like most people aren't like, oh, that's a heavy Ernie Ball. You know what I mean? They don't know what the fuck that is. They're just like, it looks— yeah, it looks like a triangle with soft edges. Jason, you're right. You're absolutely right.

Bitch-ass triangles. Oh, I had one more question I wanted to talk to you about.

Okay, Jason has a real question.

Merchandise.

No, he doesn't.

Don't get your hopes up, sweetheart. I wanted to talk about— well, the album has an American American flag on it. It's American stories. You made a hat with the artwork on it, and you sort of, I don't know, you use your fashion sense to make the first kind of non-binary tactical gear where it has a hat, it has a Velcro patch with the American flag on it. The American flag is in more of a baby blue, canary yellow color story and not the red, white, and blue. But you can turn that flag upside down or right side up depending on what part of LA I'm hanging out in on any given day.

And I look forward to this is great code switching with your Jason's going to wear it right side up when he's in OC, when he's in Echo Park upside down. I see what he's doing.

Exactly.

Don't forget that it's a real tree hat.

Yeah.

This is, this is controversial for you.

And have you received any blow? Have you, have you received any blowback from this?

No. It seems like people who've been wearing wearing it out there in the world, like my brother and Anthony Muse, the director that I worked with, they're like, I'm getting compliments all the time. People are, people are like just stopping me and being like, that's a cool hat.

It is noticeable. I mean, it's noticeable. That is good to hear because I feel like people be rocking with it. People be rocking with it.

Yeah. I mean, it's, it's, it's a tough hat because right side up, you're a person who's walking around town with an American flag hat on, which used to not be a big deal, but now it's a more of a load loaded, you know, garments.

Not for me, bro. That's— I can separate the art from the artist, you know what I'm saying?

But then when you wear the hat upside down, then you're a guy walking around with, you know, America spelled with 3 K's. You know, you're giving Rage Against the Machine, fuck the government energy, which you might not always be wanting to put out into the world. So it's really— you're making a decision when you put that hat on your head.

That's true.

Well, one thing I've thought about is like, I don't know, maybe there'll be a point in American history where, like, you know, if we got a President Zoran Momdani, and I do know that the laws would— there'd have to be like a constitutional amendment to make that possible.

Good, because I was— I didn't want to bring it up. I didn't want to kill your dreams, but I think about it every day that he can't be president.

Well, Trump is amending some of those rules for a third term, so maybe the door can swing both ways.

Exactly. Let's see what's possible. But you know what, I'm going to— I'm going to start changing. I'll change up my artwork on Spotify and I'll change the vinyl sleeve too, to be a flag right side up. And then you know what's going to happen to those upside down flag editions? Those prices are going to go up.

So Discogs, I put my kids through college with the rust of Discogs. So I'm unloading.

So everyone who, if you made it to this deep into this podcast, y'all need to get on my merch. Y'all need to be—

Cop the hat now.

Cop the CD. We went crazy on the CD. Itself designed.

It's good. It's cool.

It looks cool. Looks cool. Reminds me of some, uh, maybe 2001, 2005-ish era New Order with some of the color— New Order color choices.

That's an amazing— that's the highest compliment. Yeah, I didn't— I don't need to tell this couple guys that the band The Killers was named after the fictional band in a New Order music video from that era.

Oh, I, I do know that. I do know.

We'll talk Was that Crystal?

I don't remember.

We'll talk off mic about the new Brandon Flowers because it has a lot of, a lot of pedal steel. His new solo album, it's great. And it's— I'm saying it's all happening. We've talked about it. It's all happening.

Maybe he can open for you on tour next time.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Something small, something light. All right, American Stories in stores everywhere that you listen to music. Uh, I love the album, Ross. It's great. I listened to yesterday driving from Tucson to Phoenix. The perfect, you know, really deep in America, I would say.

I, I listened to it twice as I signed about 150 copies at the Rough Trade store, which is now in Rockefeller Center. I did not know it was there. When I agreed to do this in-store, I thought it was in, uh, in Brooklyn. Yeah, but it is no longer in Brooklyn. But it's a really cool store, and, and the people who came out were really cool people. I was like, oh fuck, I like, I like my fans. I fuck with my fans.

All right, thank you, Rostam. Good to see you, bro, and, um, we'll see you soon.

Thank you, guys.

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